Reconciling the number of active users from the output of the maxusers and listu verbs

 I am "struggling"  to reconcile the number provided as the number of users (under the Used licenses column) provided when the maxusers is run; and the count of the users when the listu command is run.

I assume (and understand) that a printer would be considered as a user, but what other process takes up a user count?

Do background tasks add to the user count?

I see some (listed in listu) other than those taken up by the OFSI - generally port 513 - 517

Is there an explanation in some document?

Thanks 

Hi,

d3 uses 'device licensing' which is probably where your confusion lies.

The 'maxusers' command shows you the license allowed and it's current consumed state; whereas 'listu' simply shows individual PIBs logged on.

Printers do not consume a license.

I suspect there is document somewhere explaining device licensing; but in general it allows for certain combinations of connections per IP address which fit 'into' ONE d3 license.

Thus an 'x' user d3 licence can actually support [potentially] > 'x' concurrent connections [with each reported via listu].

Check the documentation you received with your d3 system and search for 'device licensing' and see if anything is there. There may also be something on RBC.

Hope this helps.

Hi,

d3 uses 'device licensing' which is probably where your confusion lies.

The 'maxusers' command shows you the license allowed and it's current consumed state; whereas 'listu' simply shows individual PIBs logged on.

Printers do not consume a license.

I suspect there is document somewhere explaining device licensing; but in general it allows for certain combinations of connections per IP address which fit 'into' ONE d3 license.

Thus an 'x' user d3 licence can actually support [potentially] > 'x' concurrent connections [with each reported via listu].

Check the documentation you received with your d3 system and search for 'device licensing' and see if anything is there. There may also be something on RBC.

Hope this helps.

Hi David

Thanks for this prompt response.

Please explain the difference here:

license allowed and it's current consumed state; whereas 'listu' simply shows individual PIBs logged on

I was under the impression that individual PIBs logged on would in fact be a user and therefore be "consumed" (?)

I see no real assistance when I search for 'device licensing' in the D3 documentation 
D3 Reference Manual

Thanks

You are welcome.

Let me give an example.

Let's say you have a 10 user system. I'm going to keep it 'simple' as an example and speak just of 'telnet' connections.

Let's assume no one is logged on, until you logon via a single telnet session using a terminal emulator.

maxusers would show 10 users, one consumed.

listu would show one logged on.

Now, [assuming you are on a machine running Windows]; open a second connection from the same machine [IP address] and logon.

maxusers would show 10 users, one consumed

listu would show two logged on.

Repeat a third time.

maxusers would show 10 users, one consumed

listu would show three logged.

Do this a 4th time [now you've exceed 3/IP]:

maxusers would show 10 users, two consumed

listu would show four logged on.

I've heard device licensing referred to an n+2 licensing: Each IP can have up to 3 connections and still only consume ONE license.

It gets a bit more complicated with RPC connections such as ODBC; and further if you have connection pooling.

But I'm trying to keep the concept simple to get the idea across.

Another way to look at this is to say a licence count is not the same thing as a connection count due to this n+2 concept.

It helps not that the term 'user' is used in different places to mean different things. A 'licensed user' refers to a license condition; whereas a 'connected user' refers to a connection; or something actually doing something, running a program or running some job.

I hope that helps some more?

Hi David

A bit confusing, but thanks, did not know that. Perhaps still thinking old 1-to-1 connection of physical ports :(

I'm just still a bit confused when I see physically that I have say 5 users logged in (and working) and my maxusers reports a number 12  as used!!

BTW this is D3 V 7.x - it may be reporting incorrectly :(

Hi Stefano,

I cannot say for sure; but of course what I have been saying to you relates to the latest version of d3.

If you are under maintenance; I would strongly advise to upgrade to the latest version.

In general, it is not that hard; and there are significant improvements between v7 and 10.n

If you can, give that a go and see if then behaves more as you expect.

If you are not under AMC; then you are probably out of luck since I suspect v7 is either no longer supported or is 'sunset'; which means nothing will get fixed. In effect meaning the same thing.

Personally, I'd move to latest version.

A bit of work to do, but if you have access to source it will never be a problem. Even if you do not have source, my experience if later versions are p-code compatible meaning you may need to re-flash compile with the (W option; but otherwsie it all works from version to version.

v7 --> 10.n will probably require a file-save; uninstall, re-install, reconfigure, restore-accounts and then upgrade-account; along with a flashing all with (w

It's all documented in the installation guides.

Probably would take a half day or so; or an evening?

Then see how things are.

If you are not under maintenance; I think it is time to fix that issue too or matters like this will never be resolved to your satisfaction.

Let me know how you go.

Cheers!

David

Hi David

Sound advice and I'm on it as we speak. It's an "old" client of mine and I've managed to convince them to upgrade to 10.3x

I was just "fishing" in their environment and was "shaking my head" when I saw this.

Apologies if I appeared to be wasting your time (and effort). Believe me, it is MUCH appreciated. I find myself not wanting to accept that upgrades will sort the thing out, but then again we may need to head to the voice of our great master Brian Cram - who knows ALL :)

Thanks and have a lovely week-end.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, "knows ALL" (right, no pressure).

There are several commands that will help you here:

WHERE A

LISTU

MAXUSERS

!d3 -qn     (for D3 Linux)

nt_pinfo   (for D3 Windows)

MAXUSERS shows how many user and phantom licenses are consumed ( yes, they come from different pools ). LISTU will obviously show you the users who are logged on. WHERE A will show you either a "+" next to PIBs possibly consuming a user license, a "=" next to PIBs consuming a phantom license, and if you're running FlashConnect or socket stuff, you may see PIBs with a "#" next to them indicating they are consuming a user license AND a phantom license.

The tricky part is D3's 3-for-1 licensing model where you can get 3 connections from a single source for 1 user license ( actually it's 2 and 1 for 1, meaning you can get 2 of one connection type and 1 of another connection type but not 3 of the same connection type, connection types being telnet, ODBC, and on D3 Windows RPC ). This is where you need to see the IP address from where the PIB is connected. This is where the !d3 -qn and nt_pinfo commands come into play.

Example: MAXUSERS shows 3 user licenses consumed, but WHERE A shows 4 "+" PIBs. Then you do a !d3 -qn and look for the two PIBs coming from the same IP address.

Nice complicated answer for a simple question?

lets get something else: 
so if i have 2 Telnet conn from the same IP it will cosume only one licence BUT if i open 6 telnet conn ? it will consume only 3 licences or it will be 5 ? ( the first two consume only one and the others wich one will consume one) ?

5. You only get the second connection from the same IP for free (or third if it's a different type, like ODBC or RPC).

I count 7 users based on the following.  Where am I going wrong?  Are the 2 phantoms added to my 7 to get 9?

:WHERE A

  Ln   PCB     PIB   ABS  Stat  R1 & Return stack contents         14 Aug 2023
       FID     Stat  Base                                             10:25:33

+0100 000000E4 FF90 000018      WS_WHERE1:000    WS_WHATWHERE:000
+0107 000000EB A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0108 0000F820 A390 000018    1 RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0112 000000F0 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0113 000000F1 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0125 000000FD A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0126 000000FE A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0127 0000FF16 A390 000018    1 RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0128 0000FCA9 A390 000018    1 RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0130 00000102 F390 000018      PX_IN:000
+0131 00000103 F390 000018      PX_IN:000
+0141 0000010D A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0144 00000110 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0145 00000111 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
 0256 00000180 BF10 000018      SP_SLEEP:000     SP_SPOOLOUT:000
=0257 00007836 BF00 000018   P  SLEEPSUBX:000    RQMSLEEP:000     BR_RQM:000
=0258 00007822 BF10 000018   P  SLEEPSUBX:000    RQMSLEEP:000     PX_RQM:000
 0273 00007735 BF10 000018   P  PP_SCHED:000
:LISTU
pib# user.......... udate utime account.......... mdate mtime location.......

*100 M              08/14 10:25 DM                08/14 10:25 M
 107 A              08/14 09:12 pw                08/14 09:12 A
 108 j              08/14 08:08 PW                08/14 08:08 J
 112 T              08/14 08:26 ha                08/14 08:26 T
 113 R              08/14 08:52 ha                08/14 08:52 R
 125 B              08/14 09:34 DP                08/14 09:34 B
 126 D              08/14 08:33 DP                08/14 08:33 D
 127 C              08/14 08:28 DP                08/14 08:28 C
 128 LA             08/14 09:00 DP                08/14 09:00 L
 130 LE             08/14 09:56 ma                08/14 09:56 L
 131 G              08/14 06:56 ma                08/14 06:56 G
 141 AMELIA         08/14 06:55 cheng.ar          08/14 06:55 Amelia Kluss
 144 TIFFANYI       08/14 08:30 DP.AR             08/14 08:37 Tiffany Ireland
 145 PAYTENJ        08/14 08:59 DP.AR             08/14 09:26 Payten Jensen
 257 dm             08/12 22:38 dm                08/12 22:38 Data manager
 258 saw            08/12 22:39 AS.AR             08/12 22:39 Scott Wood
:MAXUSERS
                    Max        Used      Users            Expiration
   Pool Name      Licenses   Licenses   Allowed   Weeks      Date
---------------   --------   --------   -------   -----   -----------
User                   15          9        15       0
Server                  1          1         1       0
Connections/IP          3          0         3       0
Phantoms               15          2        15       0
RPC Clients             3          0         3       0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
:NT_PINFO
PIB  ThreadId T  User  Kernel AllocK CommtK        Device
==== ======== = ====== ====== ====== ====== =============================
   1 000016e0 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   2 0000163c T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   3 00000008 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   4 000010b8 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   5 000002cc T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   6 00000410 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   7 00001364 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   8 000008a8 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   9 0000114c T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
  12 00000a24 T  0.000  0.000     15     23 Disconnected
 100*00001578 T  0.031  0.062    257    278 -----.246.196;57049     1st license
 107 000017c8 T  0.187  0.171   1338   1689 -----.146.162;62439     2nd
 108 00000a9c T  1.031  0.359   3395   4386 -----.146.162;64887     2nd
 112 00000c04 T  1.468  0.312   2162   3220 -----.239.251;49859     3rd
 113 00000b7c T  1.140  0.312   1801   2363 -----.239.251;61835     3rd
 125 00000218 T  0.234  0.062   1277   2304 -----.207.164;55279     4th
 126 000000b0 T  7.828  0.687   1739   2086 -----.207.164;51081     4th
 127 000014f8 T  5.953  1.000   1809   3374 -----.207.164;59579     5th
 128 000007b0 T  5.750  0.828   1605   2682 -----.207.164;59058     5th
 130 0000147c T  1.093  0.781    530    653 -----.144.27;59035      6th
 131 00000860 T  5.515  2.718   4466   5466 -----.144.27;63319      6th
 144 00001458 T  2.843  0.640   3270   4144 -----.201.27;2919       7th
 145 00001620 T  3.281  0.734   1557   1944 ------.201.27;23100     7th
 256 00000f5c P  0.125  0.156      5      8 (null)
 257 00001200 P  0.078  0.062     52     76 (null)
 258 0000122c P 25.703 80.843   2429   3691 (null)
 273 00000f68 P  0.093  0.125     49     59 (null)

I count 7 users based on the following.  Where am I going wrong?  Are the 2 phantoms added to my 7 to get 9?

:WHERE A

  Ln   PCB     PIB   ABS  Stat  R1 & Return stack contents         14 Aug 2023
       FID     Stat  Base                                             10:25:33

+0100 000000E4 FF90 000018      WS_WHERE1:000    WS_WHATWHERE:000
+0107 000000EB A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0108 0000F820 A390 000018    1 RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0112 000000F0 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0113 000000F1 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0125 000000FD A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0126 000000FE A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0127 0000FF16 A390 000018    1 RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0128 0000FCA9 A390 000018    1 RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0130 00000102 F390 000018      PX_IN:000
+0131 00000103 F390 000018      PX_IN:000
+0141 0000010D A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0144 00000110 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
+0145 00000111 A390 000018      RDL_GETCHAR:000  RDL_GETCHAR:000  READLINX:000
                                PX_INPUT:000
 0256 00000180 BF10 000018      SP_SLEEP:000     SP_SPOOLOUT:000
=0257 00007836 BF00 000018   P  SLEEPSUBX:000    RQMSLEEP:000     BR_RQM:000
=0258 00007822 BF10 000018   P  SLEEPSUBX:000    RQMSLEEP:000     PX_RQM:000
 0273 00007735 BF10 000018   P  PP_SCHED:000
:LISTU
pib# user.......... udate utime account.......... mdate mtime location.......

*100 M              08/14 10:25 DM                08/14 10:25 M
 107 A              08/14 09:12 pw                08/14 09:12 A
 108 j              08/14 08:08 PW                08/14 08:08 J
 112 T              08/14 08:26 ha                08/14 08:26 T
 113 R              08/14 08:52 ha                08/14 08:52 R
 125 B              08/14 09:34 DP                08/14 09:34 B
 126 D              08/14 08:33 DP                08/14 08:33 D
 127 C              08/14 08:28 DP                08/14 08:28 C
 128 LA             08/14 09:00 DP                08/14 09:00 L
 130 LE             08/14 09:56 ma                08/14 09:56 L
 131 G              08/14 06:56 ma                08/14 06:56 G
 141 AMELIA         08/14 06:55 cheng.ar          08/14 06:55 Amelia Kluss
 144 TIFFANYI       08/14 08:30 DP.AR             08/14 08:37 Tiffany Ireland
 145 PAYTENJ        08/14 08:59 DP.AR             08/14 09:26 Payten Jensen
 257 dm             08/12 22:38 dm                08/12 22:38 Data manager
 258 saw            08/12 22:39 AS.AR             08/12 22:39 Scott Wood
:MAXUSERS
                    Max        Used      Users            Expiration
   Pool Name      Licenses   Licenses   Allowed   Weeks      Date
---------------   --------   --------   -------   -----   -----------
User                   15          9        15       0
Server                  1          1         1       0
Connections/IP          3          0         3       0
Phantoms               15          2        15       0
RPC Clients             3          0         3       0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
:NT_PINFO
PIB  ThreadId T  User  Kernel AllocK CommtK        Device
==== ======== = ====== ====== ====== ====== =============================
   1 000016e0 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   2 0000163c T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   3 00000008 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   4 000010b8 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   5 000002cc T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   6 00000410 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   7 00001364 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   8 000008a8 T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
   9 0000114c T  0.000  0.000     15     24 Disconnected
  12 00000a24 T  0.000  0.000     15     23 Disconnected
 100*00001578 T  0.031  0.062    257    278 -----.246.196;57049     1st license
 107 000017c8 T  0.187  0.171   1338   1689 -----.146.162;62439     2nd
 108 00000a9c T  1.031  0.359   3395   4386 -----.146.162;64887     2nd
 112 00000c04 T  1.468  0.312   2162   3220 -----.239.251;49859     3rd
 113 00000b7c T  1.140  0.312   1801   2363 -----.239.251;61835     3rd
 125 00000218 T  0.234  0.062   1277   2304 -----.207.164;55279     4th
 126 000000b0 T  7.828  0.687   1739   2086 -----.207.164;51081     4th
 127 000014f8 T  5.953  1.000   1809   3374 -----.207.164;59579     5th
 128 000007b0 T  5.750  0.828   1605   2682 -----.207.164;59058     5th
 130 0000147c T  1.093  0.781    530    653 -----.144.27;59035      6th
 131 00000860 T  5.515  2.718   4466   5466 -----.144.27;63319      6th
 144 00001458 T  2.843  0.640   3270   4144 -----.201.27;2919       7th
 145 00001620 T  3.281  0.734   1557   1944 ------.201.27;23100     7th
 256 00000f5c P  0.125  0.156      5      8 (null)
 257 00001200 P  0.078  0.062     52     76 (null)
 258 0000122c P 25.703 80.843   2429   3691 (null)
 273 00000f68 P  0.093  0.125     49     59 (null)

Actually, you've got  two instances of 4 connections from the same IP address. Only the second connection is free (see the above dialog between Alberto and myself):

125 00000218 T  0.234  0.062   1277   2304 -----.207.164;55279     4th
126 000000b0 T  7.828  0.687   1739   2086 -----.207.164;51081     4th
127 000014f8 T  5.953  1.000   1809   3374 -----.207.164;59579     5th
128 000007b0 T  5.750  0.828   1605   2682 -----.207.164;59058     6th

130 0000147c T  1.093  0.781    530    653 -----.144.27;59035      7th
131 00000860 T  5.515  2.718   4466   5466 -----.144.27;63319      7th
144 00001458 T  2.843  0.640   3270   4144 -----.201.27;2919       8th
145 00001620 T  3.281  0.734   1557   1944 -----.201.27;23100      9th